***** CORPS HISTORY – 1963 *****
February 1, – Official Corps’ Ceremonies, B.C.J.H.S., Delmar, N.Y.
After planning for this event for several weeks (see corps meeting minutes), we were able to present this program for all to see. Those attending included firemen Bill Webb and Henry Klinke (both in uniform), parents, and various lady friends. After setting up the cafeteria at 4:30 p.m., we all grabbed a bite to eat and then changed into Colonial uniforms for the 8:00 p.m. show. We only had one “go through” before doing the bit for all to see, so things were a bit “fuzzy” to the college crew, as they hadn’t practiced at any of the meetings. The general effect was good, however, and after our presentation we all got a chance to converse with the firemen, Roger Fryer, an American Legion representative, and parents. Those attending included Dick MacDowell, (who did an outstanding job in the ceremony) appointed Adjutant, Ray Hauley, appointed Fife Sergeant and awarded a five year pin along with Bob Barned, Bob Morse, appointed Fife Corporal, Dave Gregory, a three year man, John Fitzgerald, also a three year veteran, Baron Fitzgerald, Dave Morse, Brit Brown, also a three year man, Buz Olsen, appointed Drum Sergeant, Bill Frueh, and Art Allen, flag bearer throughout the “Array.” Bob Mulligan took charge of the assembly and was sworn in by Dick MacDowell by placing his left hand on the flag (held in a horizontal position by Art), and raising his right. The rest of the group were also sworn in this way. First the entire corps was sworn in by ranks, thus making an official induction into the “new” Third Regiment Veteran Volunteers. Other appointments were then made and awards were presented. The tunes played and the general procedure can be found on the next page. This was the program for the event, and was written by Bob Mulligan. Our hats must be tipped to Bob for his efforts and time which went into the planning of this event. After chatting for awhile, we changed out of the uniforms and left around 9:00 p.m. with talk of having another “Array” in June ’63.
“MILITARY ARRAY” PROGRAM
What is an array? In Colonial times it was customary for a high ranking officer or government official to review the militia units of a colony, so that the units might be inspected as to the quality of uniforms, arms drill, officers, etc.*
Tonight’s ceremonies will witness the swearing in of the corps, the appointment of noncommissioned officers, the presentation of awards, the playing of music, an inspection, and the passing in review by the entire corps. The music we will play has been selected for its appropriateness to this ceremony.
1. Old Dan Tucker – (the bass drummer’s favorite for a century) was the theme song of Helderberg’s “Anti Rent Wars.”
2. Rally Round the Flag – is one of the many stirring songs written during the Civil War.
3. White Cockade – a corps theme song, is a Scottish melody some 250 years old.
4. Connecticut competition Piece – consisting of Yankee Doodle (A strain), Blue Bells (first 4 bars), Golden Slippers (AABB), Willie Weaver (A strain), Paddy O’Toole (AABBCC), Blue Bells (first 4 bars), Huntington (AABBCC), and Dottie (last 2 bars A strain).
5. The New York Volunteer – the corps will pass in review to this Civil War tune based on a much older English folk tune.
*All commands are taken from Upton’s Tactics (1866).
February 21, – Senior Citizens’ Concert, Bethlehem Central Junior High School, Delmar, N.Y.
The boys began to gather at the music room in the Junior High about 7:00 p.m., however, it was still in doubt whether we would be ready for our 8 o’clock performance, as our “dependable” snare drummer was several minutes late. Those on time included: Rick Stewart, Dick MacDowell, the Fitz bros., Dave Morse, Bill Frueh and Color bearer, Pete Schaap. After changing into colonial uniforms, we ran through a few tunes, and then when Buz arrived, we headed for the cafeteria, entering from the hall, as in the “Array.” We played Old Dan Tucker, and then the Star Spangled Banner (facing the audience). Bob Mulligan was then introduced with the corps referred to as the “Pride of the Tri Village Area.” Bob had a well prepared talk on the life of Washington, with each piece fitting into his story. He began by telling of George’s life on a plantation and worked into the tune Roast Beef. This was used as a dinner call on such a plantation before it was adopted by the army. Rick Stewart and Buz then played this. The talk went on and told of the battles of the Revolution, with various diaries read. The following tunes were sketched in by the entire corps: Girl Left Behind Me, Road To Boston, and Yankee Doodle. The significance of The White Cockade was explained and then that tune was played. Next was Jefferson and Liberty, with information that it was used during Washington’s presidential campaign under the name Washington and Liberty. The concert ended with Wrecker’s Daughter. We marched out to Willie Weaver in tribute to the leader of the Senior Citizens. A free meal followed.
April 27, – Bicycle Rodeo, Westgate Shopping Center, Albany, N.Y.
This event was held at the shopping center in the afternoon, under the sponsorship of the Optimists Club of Albany. It featured races and other events for bicycles. With the corps providing a musical addition. We marched around the shopping center several times. We were fairly well received, with British Grenadiers getting the most applause. We were rewarded for our efforts with free hot dogs and soda.
April 28, – Opening Day Ceremonies Cooperstown, N.Y.
The corps left from the Junior High at 10 a.m., With drivers Mr. Frueh, Mr. Brown. and Bob MuIIigan. The fife line was composed of the Morse Bros., the Fitzgerald Bros., Ray Hauley, Dick MacDowell, Rick Stewart, and Brit Brown. The drum line was as usual: Buz Olsen, and Chuck Roberts, on snare, Bill Frueh on bass, Greg “Magoo” (formerly McGrath) Warner carried the flag, and Bob MuIIigan was drum major. Upon arriving in Cooperstown we went directly to the Farmers Museum, where we changed into the Colonial uniforms, then went out to the cars and to town for lunch. Our three appearances throughout the afternoon consisted of a parade of the corps around the ViIIage Crossroads and a short concert in front of the Inn. We were very well received by the crowd on hand for the opening. In between our playing stints we looked around at the exhibits, took pictures, held impromptu jam sessions, and sampled the punch and cookies provided for the guests. Several members managed to get acquainted With some of the local girls, which added much to their enjoyment of the event. A new member, E. J. Fitzgerald, also accompanied us on this trip.
May 1, – May Day Parade, Albany, N.Y.
This parade took place on a cold, rainy, windy night, and so we didn’t even wear our uniforms, instead, those of us who braved the weather, were bundled up in heavy coats and sweaters. The corps was small, with the Morse Bros., Dick MacDowell, Bob Mulligan, Greg Warner, Chuck Roberts, Bill Frueh, attending. After finding our place in line, we kept warm by drinking coffee and jamming it up, playing real fast tunes to keep our fingers warm. We finally got under way, with the only problem being to hold onto the flag and drums in the wind. As soon as the parade was over, we all got into the Frueh’s car and headed for home.
May 12, – Tulip Festival, Albany, N.Y.
This event saw a good sized corps on hand, with a fife line of Dave Gregory, Dick MacDowell, Fitzgerald and Morse Bros., Brit Brown, Rick Stewart, a color guard of Clem Munger, Greg Warner, E. J. Fitzgerald; drummers Chuck Roberts, Buz Olsen, Bill Frueh, and Bob Mulligan was drum major. As usual, the pageant was held in Washington Park. The corps paraded around the park for a few minutes before the pageant began in order to practice the Connecticut Competition piece, which we intended to use in the pageant. Then our time came to enter the field area, we did so playing Yankee Doodle, however, due to a mix-up, this is all we played. Just as Bob Mulligan signaled for the Conn. Comp. Piece to be played, the announcer brought on the next portion of the program. Needless to say, this made the corps very unhappy. The only bright note in the day came on the evening news of Channel 10. The corps got excellent coverage, despite its short performance, and a letter of apology from the head of the Festival, also helped to make amend for the error.
May 29, – Senior Citizens, Washington Avenue Armory, Albany, N.Y.
The corps assembled at the Junior High, with the following present: Fitz. bros., Stewart, Hauley, MacDowell, Morse bros., Buz, Chuck Roberts, Bill Frueh, Peter Schaap, Magoo, Tracy Kunze, and Bob Mulligan. Upon arriving at the armory, we held a jam session on the street, while waiting to go on. After being told we would “go on any minute,” we finally went on at 10:00 p.m. We were quite well received as we marched around the dance floor playing such tunes as Huntington, and Old Saybrook. After playing for about 20 minutes, we marched off and headed for home. One of our former members, Jim Colfer, was outside the armory, and enjoyed talking and jamming with the corps.
May 30, – Memorial Day Parade, Delmar, N.Y.
Those who attended this parade, were the same as those for the previous event, with the exception of Tracy Kunze, and John Fitzgerald. The corps formed at Ridge Road and marched with the Delmar Fire Company. The parade was the same as usual with the corps getting a fair amount of applause most of the way. We also took part in the ceremony at Memorial Park, where we again played the Conn. Comp. Piece. After the ceremonies, most members, including those who participated in the Albany parade, went to Thatcher Park with their dates. This included jam sessions of playing and singing, plus food and beer. It was decided to make this picnic an annual event.
June 16, – Alumni Parade, Brattleboro, Vt.
The corps left the Junior High at about 10:30 a.m. The corps was fairly large with a full drum line and color guard with Bob Mulligan serving as drum major. The group changed into their colonial uniforms at the Elks Hall, and had time for lunch and some practicing before the parade. Just as we were forming, a downpour began. We were well soaked before we could reach cover, but soon the sun came out and the parade began. The warm sun dried us off before the end of the parade, which featured many excellent floats. Our group was very well received. On the way back, some of the group stopped at Hogback Mountain for food and souvenirs. Another group stopped at the Bennington Monument, where they had a jam session and bought souvenirs, including some miniature fifers and drummers.
June , – Saratoga Fireman’s Parade, Saratoga, N.Y.
The corps left the junior high school at approximately 11:00 a.m. Drivers were the Fruehs, Bob Mulligan, and Barney. We arrived there in plenty of time, however, it took us a while to locate the place where we were to organize. The cars did not leave together and so it also took us a while to locate each other. Those members who attended this parade included: Barney, Fitzgerald brothers, Morse brothers, Brit Brown, Dave Gregory, Dick MacDowell, (fifers), Chuck Roberts, Bill Frueh, Buz Olsen, (drummers), Bob Mulligan (drum major), E.J. Fitzgerald, and Magoo (color guard). Most of us had to change into our uniforms in the cars after we arrived there. The Fuller Road Firemen were in a good mood when we met them and they liked us very much. The parade was scheduled to step off at 2:00 p.m. which it did but it was such a large parade that we didn’t step off until about 4:0O. This meant that we had roughly three hours to wait before we stepped off. During this time we found several things to do, such as grabbing a bite to eat, saluting and presenting arms (with our swords) as the parade marched by us, yelling out comments to the majorettes, talking to and playing the fife with the Rhinebeck Fife and Drum Corps. By the time we stepped off, we were warmed up quite a lot and so we played well. The parade was approximately 3 or 3 1/2 miles long and proceeded along the main road from one end of town to the other. One thing different about our corps in this parade was that we marched with a large distance between ranks. It worked out quite well this way. The parade ended at a large field where free food and refreshments were served. Before breaking up, we played our competition medley “Connecticut.” We were happy to meet and have a jam session with the Colonial Greens from Mount Vernon, N.Y., the Rhinebeck Fife and Drum Corps, and especially the Charles Dickerson Fife, Drum, & Bugle Corps from New Rochelle, N.Y. This jam session turned out to be, for most of us, the best part of the whole trip. Some of the corps members became under the influence of alcohol and made quite a wild time of it all. Some of the members including John Fitz., Bob Mulligan, and Dave Morse went to the Pine Lake Musket – Shoot and stayed over night there. This parade was very well organized and was one of the outstanding events of the year.
July 4, – Firemen’s Parade, Ravena, New York.
We left from the Junior High with drivers: Ray Hauley, Bob Barned, and Mr. Frueh. We played for the New Baltimore Fire Company, and had a fairly large corps, with Jim Colfer and Paul Hannan filling in. Upon arriving in Ravena, we located our formation spot and began a lively jam session. Unfortunately, things. got a little too lively, and Jim Colfer broke a bass drum head. This caused a slight argument among corps members and two of the group refused to march because of Jim and the broken head. They were finally persuaded to go on, however, and the parade began. We were well received by the firemen and the spectators despite the bass drum difficulty. After availing ourselves of the free refreshments. we returned to Delmar.
July 20, – Deep River Muster, Deep River, Conn.
July I9, the 1963 Deep River weekend began at 9:00 a.m. Friday. Mr. and Mrs. Frueh left with Bill Frueh, Brit Brown, and E.J. Fitzgerald, Arrived in Deep River about 2 p.m. After setting up the tent on Devitt Field with some difficulty, the group headed for Town Beach, Westbrook, for a dip in the ocean. The boys returned to the field, where other corps were starting to arrive. It was still quiet, however, a far cry of what it would be the next day. As the boys settled down to wait for the rest of the group, the rains came. Unfortunately, most of the rest were just leaving and had to drive a full 150 miles in the downpour. Bob Mulligan and his group were the first to arrive around 10:00 p.m. The next car to arrive was Ray Hauley which was late due to windshield wiper difficulties. The only other people to come were with Bob Barned, and would come in the morning. By the time everyone was settled in their tents at Devitt field, the ground was thoroughly soaked, and so were the members. Nobody got much sleep because of this, and because they were full of anticipation for the excitement of the coming day. The following morning we ate breakfast, changed into our uniforms, and registered the corps early. The corps stepped off at 1:30 p.m. in fourth position, marching to the tune of Yankee Doodle. Both the parade and the review were well covered by NBC for use on a special program to be seen later in the year. The corps finished the parade, marching onto Devitt Field playing Wrecker’s Daughter. Many pictures were taken of other corps by several corps members. The N.Y. Regimentals were selling, a record which they had recently recorded, which many members purchased. Later in the day, the corps readied, itself to perform on the field. We marched on playing Old Saybrook, played the Connecticut competition piece, and marched off playing Wrecker’s Daughter. All tunes were played well. After gobbling down a free supper, changing into comfortable clothes, we proceeded to the location of the jam session. When we got there, it was almost in full swing. During the first part of the jam session, people were wandering from group to group, but as it got later they stayed pretty much in one area. There was plenty of free beer floating around for those who were of legal age. Around 1:00 a.m., A parade in double file was started. It was noticed by several of us that Bob Mulligan was in high spirits and marching briskly along in this parade. Eventually, it was reduced to a single file with several of the marchers carrying garbage cans and banging on them. At 1:30 a.m., the jam session had dwindled down to about a dozen people, and by 2:00 a.m. it finally broke up. Amusing sidelights were Rick Stewart’s shenanigans, and Bob Mulligan’s reaction to his broken window.* Most of us either slept in the food tent or in cars, as the tents were still “sloppy” from the previous night’s rainfall. We all got about five hours sleep, which was a considerable improvement from the night before. In the morning, the tents were quickly taken down and everything was packed.
We then had breakfast and started for home. Bob Mulligan and his passengers m
ade stops at Dream Lake and Riverside Park along the way.
* Rick Stewart related the following (12/29/06): “The story behind the broken window incident is simple. After consuming several beers at the jam session, I decided to go down to the field where Bob’s car was parked to retrieve my camera. It was in his car. Of course, the car was locked and as I recall, out of frustration, I hit the passenger door window…harder than I thought and the rest is history.”
Jury 27, – Hillsdale Firemen’s Parade, Hillsdale, N.Y.
We left from the Junior High with drivers: Ray Hauley, Bob Barned, and Bob Mulligan. We arrived in time to parade at 1:00 p.m., but found that the event would not start for a couple hours. Bob Barned had to leave before the parade, as he had to work at five that night. This made us one man short and forced us to take a cut in our fee. The parade was long and hot, with the temperature in the 90’s, but the corps played fairly well. Due to complaints from the firemen, the bass drummer finished the parade playing single stick instead of the rudimental style. The corps then had a chance to mingle with other units, including the Castleton Fife and Drum Corps and the Blue Angels, an aIl-girl aggregation.
August 3, – Connecticut State Competition, Cheshire, Conn.
This was an occasion at which only Buz Olsen. Dave Gregory, and Chuck Roberts attended. They left. Albany at Approximately 1:00 p.m. on Friday in Dave’s car. They arrived in Cheshire around 5 p.m., and after seeing the Brodeurs and eating at the Green Dolphin. we went to the field where the competition was to be held. After a little excitement, the boys finally got to sleep. They arose in the morning around 8:00 a.m. After breakfast, we went to the Cheshire Academy, which was the starting point of the parade and place for registration. They helped the officials with some preliminary work and then started looking for a corps to join up with. Buz met up with a member of the N.Y. regiments, who said the rest of their corps was going to be there, and possibly could help. The boys then registered and prepared themselves for the long parade. They led the senior ancients, and were fortunate to meet four of the colonial Greens along the way. A very striking group was formed consisting of green and red uniforms and soon acquired the nickname “The Christmas Tree Corps.” As usual, many of the corps massed at the end of the parade. The senior ancient corps present included: Deep River, Landcraft, Connecticut Yanks, Plainville, Fairfield, and the two N.Y. Corps. After the parade, the competition started. We had a long time before the group went on, so they got something to eat and then practiced: Yankee Doodle, Road To Boston, Rally Round The Flag, and Sisters in that order, with roll-off before Sisters. After this they went looking for three more to march with them, as they needed 10 for the competition. They also competed in the individuals at this time. When it was time to go on the field, they had two for the color guard and a fifer from Capt. James Buxton of Uxbridge, Mass. Dark green uniforms from the Rhinebeck Jr. Corps were obtained for the color guard as was a flag from a drum and bugle corps. The group marched out on the field, nervously played the selection, then marched off. The boys were received well by the crowd. After watching the rest of the competition, they went to a local restaurant to have supper. By the time they got back, it was 7:I5, and the presentation of trophies had already started. The corps had no competition in their class, but the boys traveled home with two trophies and three medals. A third trophy was given to the Colonial Greens.
August 10, 11, – North – South Shoot, Schenectady, N.Y.
This was an unscheduled event, however, some people planned to attend. Unfortunately no report exists at this time.
September 7 – Firemen’s Parade, Athens, N.Y.
We left from the Junior High as usual and arrived in Athens in
plenty of time. This was the first parade as a fifer for Harlan Ives. Since Harlan did not have a uniform, there was some difficulty in getting him outfitted. He finally had to wear a short sleeve shirt but was otherwise o.k. After Changing our clothes in the back room of the Pickwick Market, we found our place and began a jam session. The parade, itself was rather short, but we were quite well received. After sampling the free refreshments, we headed for home.
September 8. – Fort Klock Pageant, St. Johnsville, N.Y.
We left from the Junior High with Bob Barned driving his own car. Dave Gregory driving Bob Mulligan’s car, and Bob Mulligan’s group went in the Frueh’s car with Mully driving. Ray Hauley went out later, as he had to work, but by strange quirks of fate the first one there was Ray. The Mulligan group was forced to stop when the tread and recap began coming off the Frueh car. Nine people piled into the other car, with Mully taking over the driving from Gregory. This caused some fun and also some bad moments when we approached a town police station. We finally arrived in one piece and changed into our uniforms. Some of the fifers played by the road to attract motorists. The entire corps opened the pageant by playing Revolutionary War tunes. Then later, Dave Gregory and Chuck Roberts took part in a Civil War sequence. The whole corps again played in the battle sequence. We finished the pageant by playing the Star Spangled Banner. After changing back to street clothes, we returned home via the Thruway.
October 12, – Parade, Fort Plain, N.Y.
This parade saw one of the smallest corps ever assembled for a paid parade, and also saw the downfall of Bob Mulligan’s car. Due to certain difficulties, Bob Mulligan was the only driver who was available. Therefore a system of shifts was arranged with a group leaving early in the morning and another group leaving a few hours later. The first group consisting of Rick Stewart, Buz Olsen, Greg Warner (Magoo), the Morse bros., and Bob Mulligan left on schedule, but then the fun began. On the way, the car began acting up, and by the time they reached Fort Plain, it was all but shot. Bob called back to Delmar and canceled the second shift. Those at the parade site, decided to parade for whatever fee they could get, and half the original fee was offered. Therefore, the corps, in the CiviI War uniforms, stepped off. The parade went by without incident and considering its size, the corps did well. After the parade the group was met by Bill Frueh and his father who had come in response to Bob’s call. They took the majority of the boys home with Bob Mulligan and Bob Morse in the old car. By driving slow and easy, they managed to get it home without too much trouble, but it never made another long trip.
October 13, – Firemen’s Parade, Brattleboro, Vt.
This parade, like the one the previous day, was also plagued with transportation difficulties. As a result both Mr. and Mrs. Frueh drove cars, with Mr. Ives also driving. We left from the Junior High as usual, and headed for Vermont at good speeds as we were a bit late getting started. Mr. Ives had some trouble keeping up, as his car could not make the hills too easily. We arrived in Brattleboro in just the nick of time, and quickly changed clothes in the fire hall. The corps was rather small, with fifers Harlan Ives, Dick MacDowell, Rick Stewart, and Bob and Dave Morse; drummers Buz Olsen, Chuck Roberts, and Bill Frueh. Greg Warner was flag-bearer and Bob Mulligan was drum major. The parade, as usual was quite short, but also as usual, the corps was well received. After the parade, we began a new type of jam session. This one featured singing instead of playing. This continued for several minutes and a small crowd gathered. Shortly after the end of the parade, a fire alarm sounded, and the trucks left. The fire house was then taken over by another band, which soon began to jam it up. The corps soon joined in, and found to our surprise that the band could play many corps tunes such as Rally Round and Dixie.
This produced one of the liveliest jam sessions ever seen in Brattleboro, especially on such tunes as our own “Bottle Hymn” (a jazzed up version of the Battle Hymn of the Republic), which the band picked up on right away. Many of the band members complimented us on our playing, as a good time was had by one and all, including the rather large crowd of onlookers. Before leaving, most of us ate at a local diner. On the way back, a stop was made at Hog Back Mountain. One more stop was made, this time to set off a firecracker which someone had brought along. After this brief fun was over, we returned to Delmar.
October 27, – Church Pageant, SeIkirk, N.Y.
This pageant, which was to take place two Sunday nights (at the end of October and November) was to celebrate the 2OOth anniversary of the South Bethlehem Reformed Church in SeIkirk. It presented the history of the early days in our country when the church was founded. We left Delmar in time to reach the church by 7:30 p.m. The corps wore Revolutionary War uniforms for their part in it. There was a good deal of difficulty in getting the bass drum up the stairs to the stage. We decided to leave it on stage and not try to get it down the narrow aisle with the rest of the group. We played Yankee Doodle on stage, then continued playing while marching down the aisle and out the door. We had to be careful in playing, as the leaders of the pageant were worried about our music breaking the windows. We came back into the back of the church where our trophies were displayed, along with the sign to promote recruiting. On the way out, we met the Fitzgerald brothers, who arrived too late to participate. We had a short singing session outside the church, then headed for home.
The second presentation of this pageant was to be held on the last week of November, but due to the assassination of President Kennedy, resulting in a period of mourning, it wasn’t held until the 15th of December. Our part was essentially the same, except that the bass drum wasn’t used at all. This time most members stayed to watch the entire pageant before heading home.
December 22, – Cerebral Palsy and Christmas activities.
We met at the Junior High at 9:00 a.m. Those participating included: the Fitz. bros., Morse bros., Rick Stewart, Bob Laraway, Harlan Ives, Bill Frueh, Buz Olsen, and Chuck Roberts. They proceeded to the Washington Avenue Armory with Mr. Ives, Ray Hauley, and Dave Gregory driving. There, they were joined by Bob Barned (home from college), plus drum major Bob Mulligan, and three new color guards; Tom Gannon, Dennis Chagnon, and Harry Westover. After getting organized and waiting for our turn, we marched before the cameras playing Kingdom Coming, Granny Competition Piece, and exited to the tune Old Saybrook. After this we relaxed, by drinking coffee and watching the monitor. The corps then left the armory, and also left Buz, who was busy trying to get, football star, Frank Gifford to sign his drum head. The group proceeded to Delmar for some Christmas caroling at Bill Stewart’s Gas Station, the Four Corners, Mulligan’s parents home, the Frueh’s and Bromley’s home. This last stop was to show appreciation to Mrs. Bromley for making Bob Barned’s uniform. These appearances consisted of playing Deck the Halls, Joy to the World, Silent Night, and ended with the singing of We Wish You a Merry Christmas. Following this, the corps retuned to Albany to play on the Capital steps and have a picture taken by a Times Union Photographer. The picture was taken in the light corps colonial uniforms, so members were glad when it was finally taken and they could return to the warm cars. The corps then traveled to Mulligan’s apartment where they changed into suits and ties for the corps banquet which was held at the Moon Tavern. They were rejoined at the Moon by Buz, and the festivities began. After partaking of pizza and drink, the group sang such songs as Green Grow the Rushes Oh, and The Ballad of Harry Lewis. The feeling of the corps was summed up in toasts proposed at the banquet which called for many more seasons as successful as this one.